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In an exclusive interview, veteran filmmaker Shekhar Kapur (Elizabeth, Bandit Queen, Mr India) dives deep into the subject of AI usage in filmmaking and storytelling, emphasizing on the ethics of the new trend. Unlike the popular discussion, Kapur does not fear the technology will overpower artists. He insists that storytelling remains a humane domain until the time that AI can emote and ideate like humans. Through his association with Dipankar Mukherjee's Studio Blo, the Indian filmmaker hopes to be a part of outlining a broad ethical framework in the field. Kapur is the Chairperson of the Board of AI Ethics & Creative Stewardship at Studio Blo co-founded by Mukherjee. Earlier this year, he announced his upcoming film, Warlord, which is a science-fiction that has been created using GenAI only.
Shekhar Kapur views the use of AI with a philosophical lens, calling it an existential change. "AI is an existential change. You can create the most expensive films (perhaps the Avatar films) at practically no cost with the help of AI. Is it going to destroy an industry? No, but it's going to destroy how it functioned. Why am I going for it? Because I know I'll become a dinosaur if I don't use it."
In this candid chat, the filmmaker shares his views on the clash between machines and humanity. Keeping his focus on the emotional powers of storytelling, he reveals he has already made a partner of artificial intelligence.
Citing the example of AI being used by kids as young as at the age of ten, the filmmaker calls it the "most democratic technology ever". "Does that make me out of date? Of course, it does. Am I not needed anymore? That's absolutely true - I'm not needed anymore. That's why I started a music school in Dharavi for the kids where AR Rahman and I have collaborated with Universal. Those kids, 10-year-old kids who live in slums, they've become really good."
"After the wheel, this is the one technology that flattens the pyramid. AI can now become my cinematographer, my editor,my sound designer; but do you know what it’s not? It’s not a storyteller. The reason it can’t tell stories is that AI can only handle the data that has been fed to it. It cannot handle something that doesn’t exist in its domain. I think the storyteller will become the king now. AI may not give me solutions,but it helps me find it. I can make a complete film in AI with Shah Rukh Khan. If he has a paucity of dates,I can just use Shah Rukh Khan’s image with his permission.Shah Rukh can do 25 films on the same day if he wants,in that manner,”the BAFTA award winner adds.He goes on to suggest that soon the biggest stars may dole out permissions to use their images and earn money for such AI-made films.
Mukherjee chips in to say he is learning AI (much like most of us), and filmmaking with Kapur's guidance. "AI may not replace the writer but it is a great writer's tool. AI writes horribly but it is a great way to get out of writer's block. At Studio Blo, we have been building our own AI tools, our own workflows, and our own technology. Now, even getting more expressive characters is increasingly possible. AI brings down the cost for visual effects, syncing and dubbing."
Talking about his childlike eagerness about things, Kapur says, "I get blamed a lot - (People ask me) 'Why are you still a child?' I'm still a child because if I took childhood away from myself, I'm not going to be full of wonder. AI is not full of wonder. Stanley Kubrick’s 2001: A Space Odyssey is about a spaceship that is an AI that wants to know the source of life and kills itself. When the spaceship is ordered to come back, this spaceship refuses. Kubrick crossed the line that AI can’t, that Laxman Rekha (holy border line). AI is trained by us to know what we feed it. AI today can do that what a five-year-old kid could do. What Dipankar and his company (Studio Blo) are doing is a lot. At this moment,we’re at the cusp of that fuzzy line between filmmaking and AI."
"AI is bringing change at a very fast pace. Today, most apps run out after working on a minute or so (of some aspect of filmmaking). We can make one-minute films today. Maybe a few years later, we’ll be making two-hour films like that. It'll go seamlessly. All I want to do is tell my stories. Why would that not succeed? Why would that not overtake everything else? And it's not just in films."
The use of artificial intelligence is increasing by the hour. Kapur says AI is definitely the future of filmmaking and storytelling but refuses to see it as a threat to filmmakers. "I make films on human response. And, the most interesting part is that since life is a mystery, there is no fixed set of human responses. If you ask AI 'can you fall in love?' AI will tell you, 'Here's everything that ever was written about love - all the greatest love poems'. AI can never create great stories. It can help you create great stories. As long as stories are human, it will never be able to do that. I have everything on a machine that's talking to me and I can do everything with its help but so can a five-year-old kid."
"AI filmmaking is about the knowledge of the best and affordable software for each stage of filmmaking. Earlier, making better films and competing with Hollywood was about budget; now it is not as much about money. You need knowledge of right tools,and enough passion for storytelling.Budget is no longer a stumbling block for us."
Mukherjee adds,"People who never made a film but had a good story,are now able to make films.My prediction is that in next 10 years,you will have more filmmakers because of Gen AI than there have ever been filmmakers in history since invention of cinema.That’s kind of exponential boom we will see in storytelling because of Gen AI."He also shares concerns over way AI is currently being treated as toy when it comes to filmmaking.People are often not bothered about whether they are committing any copyright infringement through their Gen AI-created films," he says.
Kapur insists that AI can get us all the help to get a starting point, but anything creative will need the human emotions of fear, curiosity and mystery. "If there is inertia, AI will dominate you. It can help you get a head start but it cannot bring those unpredictable results that come with the emotional struggles of overcoming inertia that faces humans right before creating art pieces. It can a painting, or a poem or a story or a film. The ability of AI is to not have that inertia - it does not get tired, we do."
Asked about the legal issues surrounding the usage of AI, Kapur reminds us that ideas do not have copyrights. He also says that everything, including education is based on something that already exists; therefore it is a matter of inspiration versus copying.
He then elaborates on the aspects of which Indian filmmakers can improve. "Ninety percent of what I see in India,is full of inertia.Nothing like an individual striving or fear.When Guru Dutt made Pyaasa,you could see his own struggle coming out.That could not have been made by an AI.Now,we have formulaic films and series.I am yet to watch(an Indian)series where I am unable to predict what happens next.Everything is predictable(AI can overcome if everything humans make are predictable).That surge of unpredictability is what makes art;to overcome the threat of AI is to be better than AI.That is entirely possible;maybe next year,I can make a complete film in an hour,but will it be anything beyond data that already exists?"
Mukherjee adds,"It is also about mediocrity.AI replaces mediocrity in any field,not just filmmaking.We have so many coders at Studio Blo,but we just use AI for mediocre,pattern-run codes.We do not have a front-end team;AI does all that work for us.We ensure we have human production designer,human cinematographer with working on shots that AI creates for us.If I just gave a prompt to AI,it would play all those roles,but it will reference it to something that already exists.We bring human artistry to machine to make it symbiotic to create something new and original."
Kapur insists he came to films to interact with people.The increasing use of technology cuts down the cost,but also the need for people to come together at one place.“As a filmmaker,I came to cinemas because I love working with actors.I’d go to Shabana Azmi,or Naseeruddin Shah,or Heath Ledger to ask how they felt about a shot.I see that going away(soon).That’s what I’m going to really miss.I’ll miss working with human beings.It’s painful for me.Because a lot of my creativity comes from what I call that circle of trust and love.The panic and fear an artist feels before creating the artwork,that is something AI does not have.Most artwork is created from those feelings right before the creation.”
“That’s what we’ll miss.That moment of uncertainty.That interaction of love,trust between two human beings and the coming together of two hearts and two minds.That was what I call the circle of trust and love that I created with my actors.I miss that.Maybe I should go back to theatre for that (circle of love).”